# Committee on Public Safety meeting, September 9, 2024

- When: Mon, Sep 9, 2024, 10:30 AM (Chicago time)
- Where: City Council Chamber, 2nd Floor, City Hall, 121 North LaSalle Street - Chicago, IL 60602
- Status: Scheduled & Published
- Committee: [Committee on Public Safety](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/committee/public-safety)
- Video: https://vimeo.com/1006702116
- Transcript: [full text](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/files/transcripts/1006702116.txt) (22,373 words, official captions)

## Meeting notes

> AI-written from the transcript. Speakers are inferred from cues in the recording, so treat names as estimates and check the video at the linked time.

The Committee on Public Safety, chaired by Alderperson Brian Hopkins, held a subject matter hearing under a resolution on policing technology focused on the ShotSpotter gunshot detection system, whose contract was set to end on September 22, 2024. After seven public commenters spoke, the meeting was recessed and the room cleared following a disruption; on return, the Inspector General's annual public safety report was held for a future joint hearing with the Committee on Police and Fire. The chair presented 2024 CPD and OEMC dashboard data on ShotSpotter alerts, former Superintendent Eddie Johnson spoke in support of the technology, and a SoundThinking representative answered questions about data, the Inspector General's earlier report, contract wind-down and costs. Most members who spoke supported keeping ShotSpotter, while others asked about the Inspector General's findings, possible over-policing, how the technology was originally selected, and what will replace it. The chair noted that no action could be taken at the hearing.

Topics: ShotSpotter, gunshot detection technology, police response times, Inspector General report, City Council order on ShotSpotter, public safety data

### Agenda items discussed

- [10:01](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=601) Rule 59 remote participation for Alderpersons Fuentes and Moore: passed
- [10:20](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=620) Public comment
- [41:18](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=2478) Annual report from the Office of Inspector General on public safety: held
- [50:16](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=3016) Subject matter hearing on policing technology and ShotSpotter data: discussed

### Alderpersons who spoke

- [Brian Hopkins](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/2) (chair): Presented 2024 dashboard data showing nearly 30,000 ShotSpotter alerts, 73% without a corresponding 911 call, and faster average response times compared with 911 calls. ([50:16](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=3016)); Reminded members that the hearing was held under a resolution calling for a subject matter hearing on policing technology and no votes could be taken. ([1:10:24](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=4224)); Said the Inspector General's report covered an earlier period and did not include the newly collected 2024 data. ([1:36:18](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5778))
- [Raymond A. Lopez](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/15) (alderperson): Asked the SoundThinking representative whether he disputed the data presented and about his expertise. ([1:00:53](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=3653)); Said ShotSpotter is a detection and response tool, not prevention, and that ending it in 13 days to fulfill a political promise is dangerous. ([1:05:48](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=3948)); Described a staff member's cousin who died after no one called 911 for an hour, and said the Council's order on ShotSpotter is binding. ([1:07:48](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=4068))
- [Silvana Tabares](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/23) (alderperson): Presented over 1,500 signatures from 8th Police District residents supporting ShotSpotter and commended district council members for gathering community input. ([1:10:54](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=4254))
- [Anthony Beale](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/9) (alderperson): Contrasted spending on migrants with the roughly 8 million dollar cost of ShotSpotter and said the superintendent wants the tool. ([1:13:26](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=4406)); Asked whether CPD was invited to testify and whether the data presented matched FOIA data. ([1:16:10](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=4570)); Said he requested that alderpersons with ShotSpotter in their wards get access to the alert app and received no response. ([1:20:45](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=4845))
- [Peter Chico](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/10) (alderperson): Drawing on his police experience before and after ShotSpotter, said it speeds response and saves lives and that residents at beat meetings want to keep it. ([1:23:55](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5035))
- [Desmon C. Yancy](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/5) (alderperson): Asked SoundThinking why Chicago's data on 911 calls in victim incidents differs from other cities. ([1:26:43](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5203)); Said he voted for the order on ShotSpotter and that it helped victims in his ward survive shootings in July. ([1:29:24](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5364))
- [Byron Sigcho-López](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/25) (alderperson): Asked SoundThinking to respond to the Inspector General's finding that ShotSpotter alerts rarely produce evidence of gun crime. ([1:30:47](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5447)); Asked whether the Inspector General's analysis is more independent than one from the vendor. ([1:34:39](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5679)); Welcomed a joint hearing with the Inspector General and raised the report's concerns about over-policing and a man detained for 11 months based on ShotSpotter evidence. ([1:39:12](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5952))
- [Chris Taliaferro](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/29) (alderperson): Asked whether the Inspector General's report counted unlawful discharge of a firearm as a crime. ([1:36:51](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5811)); Said ShotSpotter is needed and should not be expected to guarantee constitutional policing, which requires training and reform. ([2:10:27](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=7827)); Asked former Superintendent Johnson about technology in modern policing and asked whether ShotSpotter could integrate with video and license plate readers. ([2:12:54](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=7974))
- [Andre Vasquez Jr.](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/40) (alderperson): Asked whether any study had specifically examined a link between ShotSpotter and over-policing. ([1:42:19](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=6139)); Said false reads matter because they divert officers, and noted response times are self-reported by officers. ([1:54:31](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=6871)); Asked how ShotSpotter was originally selected and requested documentation on that process and on what the city plans to use next. ([1:56:35](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=6995))
- [Nicholas Sposato](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/38) (alderperson): Said ShotSpotter is about detection rather than stopping crime, that false reads are acceptable if it saves one life, and that he would welcome it in his ward. ([1:44:16](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=6256))
- [Marty Quinn](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/13) (alderperson): Asked about software improvements, other cities using ShotSpotter, and what happens after September 22. ([1:46:51](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=6411)); Said the superintendent, his district commander and his community support ShotSpotter and that the city cannot afford to lose technology. ([1:52:24](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=6744))
- [Derrick G. Curtis](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/18) (alderperson): Asked whether removing ShotSpotter sensors would cost the city anything. ([1:51:28](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=6688))
- [Monique L. Scott](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/24) (alderperson): Said ShotSpotter alerted police to a woman shot in her ward when no 911 call was made, and that it is a detection tool residents need. ([2:03:09](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=7389)); Asked who decided to keep ShotSpotter running during the DNC and said residents often call her office rather than 911. ([2:07:09](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=7629))
- [David H. Moore](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/17) (alderperson): Said the City Council order requiring a Council vote before ShotSpotter funding is removed must be followed and residents' voices heard. ([2:19:48](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=8388)); Said ShotSpotter helps prevent retaliation and that the administration has not said what will replace it. ([2:22:24](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=8544)); Disputed concerns about over-policing, saying precise alerts reduce stops of people in the general area of gunfire. ([2:26:16](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=8776))
- [Felix Cardona Jr.](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/31) (alderperson): Said residents at his safety meetings want ShotSpotter and asked what it would cost to reinstall sensors if the city later renewed. ([2:29:06](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=8946))
- [Nicole T. Lee](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/ward/11) (alderperson): Asked about the 60-day wind-down period in the contract and said she supports keeping ShotSpotter, citing police commanders in her district. ([2:32:35](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=9155)); Asked whether CPD only began collecting this data in January 2024 and said better data and resident reporting are needed. ([2:36:03](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=9363))

### Exchanges between members

- [1:09:08](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=4148) Alderperson Raymond A. Lopez cited the order passed under the leadership of the 17th Ward alderperson as binding on the administration.
- [1:26:12](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5172) Alderperson Peter Chico said, like Alderperson Silvana Tabares, that residents are clear they want to keep ShotSpotter.
- [1:26:32](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5192) The chair thanked Alderperson Peter Chico for sharing his personal police experience.
- [1:30:32](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5432) Vice Chair Desmon C. Yancy said he sides with Alderperson Anthony Beale on getting colleagues to support residents.
- [1:35:27](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5727) Alderperson Anthony Beale raised a point of clarification during Alderperson Byron Sigcho-López questioning about the source of the Inspector General's data.
- [1:36:18](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=5778) The chair said Alderperson Byron Sigcho-López line of questioning remained relevant while noting the report covered a different period.
- [1:44:22](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=6262) Alderperson Nicholas Sposato expressed condolences to Alderperson Raymond A. Lopez for the loss he described.
- [1:54:35](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=6875) Alderperson Andre Vasquez Jr. responded to Alderperson Nicholas Sposato that false reads matter because they divert officers.
- [2:01:43](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=7303) Alderperson Andre Vasquez Jr. cited Alderperson Anthony Beale question about how long a replacement process would take as a real concern.
- [2:10:27](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=7827) Alderperson Chris Taliaferro said Alderperson Monique L. Scott expressed what members feel about needing ShotSpotter.
- [2:25:06](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=8706) Alderperson David H. Moore referenced Alderperson Chris Taliaferro point about neighboring municipalities acquiring the technology.
- [2:28:20](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=8900) The chair thanked Alderperson David H. Moore for his leadership as lead sponsor of the ShotSpotter order.
- [2:31:12](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=9072) Alderperson Felix Cardona Jr. agreed with Alderperson David H. Moore that no replacement has been identified.
- [2:35:37](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=9337) Alderperson Nicole T. Lee said she gets the same calls Alderperson Monique L. Scott described from residents who did not call 911.
- [2:37:36](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=9456) Alderperson Chris Taliaferro joined Alderperson Anthony Beale request for alderperson access to the ShotSpotter app.
- [2:39:25](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D?t=9565) Alderperson Anthony Beale said he would resend his letter to the superintendent and add colleagues who want app access.

## Documents

- [Summary](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/files/clerk/meetingattachmentspublic/d866308c-451a-4acc-8a9c-bed06c1784d4.pdf)
- [Notice](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/files/clerk/meetingattachmentspublic/27a53cef-8510-413c-92c6-25e3ba3caf1e.pdf)
- [Agenda](https://www.chicagopolitics.org/files/clerk/meetingattachmentspublic/2bd3d896-c5c3-4d3a-81c5-fbcd2714ee56.pdf)

---
Source: https://www.chicagopolitics.org/meeting/E970E4EB-9C55-EF11-A317-001DD809A88D · Chicago Politics, an independent, nonpartisan tracker of the Chicago City Council. Guide for agents: https://www.chicagopolitics.org/llms.txt